Rachael Maves: Hello everyone, you are listening to the Rachael Maves podcast and I'm Rachael Maves, your host. Today we are talking to Dr. Dennis Wiechmann. He has served as the superintendent of Sanger Unified School District since 2022, following leadership roles as assistant superintendent of human resources and more than 20 years as the district supervisor of child welfare and attendance.

With a background as a school psychologist, he brings a strong focus on student well-being, equity, and achievement.

In addition to district leadership, Dr. Whitman has taught statistics and research methods at Fresno State and conflict resolution in the doctoral program at CSU Channel Islands. During his leadership, Sanger Unified has emphasized professional learning communities, student growth models, and continuous improvement across schools. Known for his collaborative leadership and style and strategic vision, he is driven by the belief that schools can and should change lives.

by purpose, not by chance. Dennis, thank you for joining me today. I'm really excited just hearing a little bit about your background and coming up through, I would say, a unique path into the superintendency. Why did you choose a career in education? What brought you to this space?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Thank you. I'm glad to be here.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: You know, I always, even growing up, interesting, my mom was a teacher. And so I was exposed to the power of education as early as I can remember. And so going through, even through elementary and middle school, high school, just the idea of being a, and this will sound a little.

Rachael Maves: Good.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: I should say goofy. I'm like, it might sound a little goofy, but peer mediation and peer programs, I actually was doing through middle school and high school. And that was something that I just gravitated towards and the ability to work with students and help them. And I think being paired was seeing my mom as an educator and the satisfaction that came from that. And it was stressful times too, but overall,

just the ability to, as you read earlier, make a difference in another human being's life. I really kind of gravitated towards that. And then actually took a psychology class in high school and at some point paired the two together. And that became the path, going from high school into college with my school psychology degree, and then ultimately masters in that.

Rachael Maves: So I'd love to just hear a little bit more about the conflict resolution course that you're teaching at the doctoral program. Because having that background in psychology, serving as a superintendent, I mean, that seems like just such a critical component in prepping leaders.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah, absolutely. And actually what I'll reference is the 20 years that I did as child welfare in attendance. So that I really, it was 20 years of conflict resolution. just, is any, anytime a parent was coming in to meet with me, it was because there was something probably not good that was happening. And to be able to navigate that through from an interest-based approach.

Rachael Maves: Hmm.

Rachael Maves: Bye.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: And always the interest was, you know, trying to get the students into a program or a place where they could be the most successful, given whatever circumstances those were around. So that really became my foundation for jumping in and then teaching that it was a Channel Islands doctoral program at the time. I don't do that anymore because I haven't, the superintendency really is a full-time job.

Rachael Maves: Mm-hmm.

Rachael Maves: It's a little old consuming.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah, yeah. So that really lent itself well to going in and then teaching that course through there, which really, when you look at it, interest-based bargaining was kind of the caveat and the foundation for that.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Yeah, for those of our listeners that aren't in the education space or even maybe are in the education space but don't know about interest-based bargaining, I really appreciated going through that as the superintendent of how it turned negotiations from a zero-sum game into we actually have overlapping interests and where are those places and how do we identify that and build towards that common goal versus

kind of camping out on the stakes on both sides.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah. And that can be, I can be a whole separate podcast on there because the, the positional based, it can be the positional based bargaining, that typically you see, and you see, you have seen a lot of it, with districts where they're at right now. And I know a lot of superintendents really work from a collaborative position, but ultimately you get into a spot where you have to say no. and so.

Rachael Maves: Yeah, I know, it could.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Mm-hmm.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: You know, that's the difficulty sometimes navigating that through. We have a very good relationship with our union leaders and we're small, we're 13,000 students, 13,200. So our ability to individually know all of the employees, I think is super helpful. It doesn't mean that it isn't difficult because when there are a limited amount of resources and you want to, compensation is always the perfect example.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: And you want to offer as much compensation as you can, especially when you know cost of living. That becomes difficult because you potentially don't have the funds to do it, but you want to. And so you've got to, you know, you have to navigate your way through that.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah, so from your lens as a current sitting superintendent, having been in this role now for a few years, what are the things that are keeping you up at night in the education sector?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: I think the biggest one right now, I guess from the global perspective that keeps me up at night is just the way schools are funded. And I think you see a lot of that just across the state of California. You've seen a lot of the bigger districts go to strike or almost get to strike. so thinking about, okay, from a funding perspective is the inflation just really goes.

Rachael Maves: Mm.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: exponentially through the roof. And we know our employees, both classified and certificated, they do amazing, you know, they do amazing work coming through and the ability to honor that. And it does come down at some point, how are you going to compensate to match, you know, the, the effort and dedication that people put into their jobs and again, classified or certificated, but it isn't funded that way.

So I think, you know, looking through and also the enrollment in California and just looking at the declining enrollments coming across that, that just puts a tremendous amount of pressure on the district. And for us in singer unified, have a changing demographic. So our unduplicated pupil count actually has dropped pretty significantly.

Rachael Maves: Mm-hmm.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Hmm.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: which is, you know, how we're navigating, you know, the next step, how are we going to navigate the reduction in funds that are going to come over the next three years? So those are really the issues. I think from the global perspective, those are the main issues that that at this point, not only saying are unified, but I think every district in California is having to grapple with a little bit.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: So as you think about that, because I heard you say two different things. One is just the funding model and how it's currently structured. And I think the way in which it really inhibits us from putting teachers and classified staff into a different pay category. So that's one. And then the second one is declining enrollment that you guys are that.

California in general is seeing and across the country actually I would say in some states. So as you think about that what are the like two ways that you're thinking about moving forward for your own district or just in general?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: So obviously with the funding model that we have in now, we're going through and we're looking at all of the service. So they're very specific to Sanger Unified. And I know the other districts are doing something similar because we, even though there's a lot of superintendents, it really is a small group that are connected to that. just working through and figuring out, how do we be more efficient with the services that we're offering? And how are we going to

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: know, do those services if indeed it ends up impacting the number of employees that we have to provide those services. So that's the navigation that we're going through now.

There also is a lot of push. actually was able to testify in front of the Senate and Assembly Finance Committee, I think a month ago, and really talking about the enrollment-based funding versus ADA-based funding. And there's a lot of, you can talk to the legislatures, they understand, and it's like, yeah, no, we know we need to do enrollment-based funding, but I think the estimate that came through would be about $6 billion.

to adjust the Prop 98 to reflect an enrollment-based funding. And I always kind of laugh because no business would run where you get funded only on a percentage of services that you deliver. So we've got 13,200 students, but yet we're not funded on 13,200 students. We're funded on 94, 95 % of those students, even though you still have to provide the

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: the services and quality education and support services. So they know they need to fix it. I don't know what the timeframe, potentially the new governor coming in will have a little bit of impact on that. But there's a lot of pressure on that, you know, across the state. So.

Rachael Maves: Hmm.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Well, the theory behind that is, well, if the students aren't there, then that's why they tied it to that. So it would create an incentive for getting students that would show up to school. And then if they're not there, they're not really being educated. But I think you can make a pretty good argument. How would you respond to that? I won't make the argument for you. How would you respond to that?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah, you know, I, yeah, here's the beauty of being in child welfare attendance for as long as I was before that really base funding and the way they changed it to 88. It was because the graduation rates were so low. And so they went through and their, you know, with the graduations like that, students were coming to school. So then on the backside, the legislature said, then we're not going to fund unless the kids come to school.

Rachael Maves: Mm-hmm.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: and you have to put in service, know, support, SARB, what have you to increase your enrollment, which then by default would increase the graduation requirement. So my answer to the other side of that, there's other ways to hold districts accountable with graduation rate. We have the dashboard now. I think it's an expectation. But to your point to, you know, a legislature that are somebody that says, well, you shouldn't get the money because that student isn't there.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: but the teacher is still there, the counselor is still there, all of the staff that are working with the students, they're still there and we need the staff for the 13,000 students. the responsibility of educating a student doesn't go away because they might be absent or sick for a day. In fact, it actually makes it a little bit more difficult to go through and especially for our certificated staff.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yes, that's right. Yes.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: getting them the work to make up and yeah, when you look at the rigor that we try to set, missing any school time is gonna be difficult, because everything scaffolds. And so it ends up being double work on our staff and the longer a student's absent, the more difficult it is. I could make a philosophical argument that you probably need more money based on your absences, so then you can put in additional supports and services to support them.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah, that's great.

Rachael Maves: Yeah, I 100 % agree because I do think it's a misnomer and just kind of an under like a gap in understanding that when a student

just because they're not at school doesn't mean that there's this work that comes up along the back end. And I think what you said is exactly right. Getting them caught up, making sure that they have everything that they need. Not just once they execute and turn something in, but did they really understand the information that they need to be able to move on to that next space? Like that's a lot of work anytime that a student misses. So yeah, I think that you're right with that piece. There's just a gap there. Yeah.

So this is actually our last question, Dennis. You're just kind of flying through these. What question are we in education are we not asking that we really should be?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Boy, that's a big one. What questions are we? gosh.

I don't, okay, that's interesting. And I'm trying to think what would be an example. Man, that's tough. we get so, I'm just laughing thinking to myself, what question if I bring it down to singer unified. So if I guess if I bring it down to more of a local setting, the questions going through for us, we're asking them. But basically when we go through and say, okay,

looking at student performance, that ability to continue to increase that, the multi-tiered systems of support, our response to intervention. And I guess I look at that from, okay, now I'll go back and give you, okay, so this will prompt a question. It does, and I think one of the things that, I am always the glass is half full. So,

Rachael Maves: Mm-hmm.

Rachael Maves: It takes a while to process this one, doesn't it? It's a kind of a sticky one.

Rachael Maves: Mm.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: And we had already started talking about this in a cabinet before our LCAP came back and it's going to, you know, our unduplicated pupil count is going to go down. But one of the things I think we have to be careful out in education is as technology has advanced. And I'm a proponent of AI. think it's wonderfully useful. It's the equivalent for people who come and say, well, you shouldn't use AI. To me, that's the equivalent of, well, you shouldn't have used the internet coming through. So.

It needs to be controlled within there. But what it started bringing up to us, because we're a one on one district, is actually going back and saying, OK, what really should be a percentage of time that students are using a device for us, it's iPads, from an instructional support standpoint versus that hands on neurological, hands on learning?

Rachael Maves: Hmm.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yes. Yes.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Because the pendulum when it went one-on-one and COVID really I think added some fire to this because everybody had to go one-on-one We had to develop those those base systems, but now be able to come back and go okay is is a you know a kindergartener with an iPad You know that they can take that they have assigned to them versus potentially going back to a computer lab model And saying no focusing and our staff does a great job. I can walk through

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: We have a lot of project-based learning stuff that's happening, but I think that forces the bigger question, what is a good balance within there?

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: You you brought up something I've actually been thinking a lot about these last couple of weeks because there's been such a movement recently around getting technology out of the classroom. And as I was thinking about that, the question that came up for me is in how are we utilizing technology in the classroom? If it is, and I would say, unfortunately, I think that there probably is a leaning this way.

of we're putting kids in front of screens and then expecting them to engage or interact with whatever latest thing that it is, then I would say, yeah, that's probably a misuse of technology. But when we are utilizing technology purposefully that are building actually skills that they're going to need when they get out to the workforce, then to me, that seems like the appropriate space. And I do get a little bit concerned that we are

over-correcting, like you just said, and moving in that space of removing it completely versus almost doing like an internal audit of your system and organization to say, how are we using it in the first place? And what are the appropriate uses that we can really lean into and build capacity around versus just removing altogether?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah, 100%. And for us, we are embarking on that path. And it will be collaborative with our teachers, with our school sites, just to answer the question, as you said, what from a practitioner standpoint, what's a good balance? Because you cannot throw all of technology out. One, we use a lot of it because we've transitioned to a growth model. So we still have proficiency.

Rachael Maves: Hmm.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: But when you start looking at a growth model down to the individual teachers, we have to have something to measure that that's reliable and valid. And so, you know, that's going to come through and the state testing, by the way, is all online. So there are some assessments, knowledge that has to come with that. So I do think it's a balance. And so we'll work on that. It's actually going to be a year process for us to go through and kind of work with our teachers and staff collaboratively.

Rachael Maves: Yeah, that's great.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: to say where is that balance gonna come?

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: I might have frozen.

Rachael Maves: there you go, Dennis. Yep.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: There we go. Nice. dropped a little bit, so I'm not sure what part you got or what part I need to repeat.

Rachael Maves: I heard the part of you're gonna take the whole next year and work with your staff collaboratively to identify that and map out what that looks like.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah. And come up with recommendations that then we can, you know, we've, we've got a base, just like you said, we've got that audit, we know where it's not going away, but how do you use it? So it's a good balance.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

I'd love to, once you go through that process, get you back on to find out what the outcome is and what are the recommendations did the staff make and what shifts and changes are you going to put into place? I'm really curious.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: absolutely.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: Yeah. And I'd love to, because I think again, you know, there's other districts doing it too, but it just, it's a good time because, know, the pendulum and trying to keep the pendulum in the middle, that almost becomes the art because society is going to pivot so far the other way that it's like, no, hold tight. There's still some benefits. We just need to make sure it's balanced and it's, it's, it is developmentally and instructionally appropriate.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah.

Rachael Maves: Yeah, that makes sense. Well, I really appreciate your time today, Dennis, and getting to hear a little bit about your story and your thinking and appreciate the leadership that you have at Singer Unified.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: thank you. I always tell people I'm blessed to be here. It's a great system. I've been here for quite some time. So to be able to step in and then, you know, it's gradual improvements at this point that we look at. It's a very high functioning system. So I'm excited. I always tell people I'm just blessed to be able to be part of that and part of that continued development.

Rachael Maves: We're

Rachael Maves: Yeah, well they're lucky to have you. Thanks again, Dennis.

Dr. Dennis Wiechmann: thank you. Thank you. a,

Rachael Maves: That spring brings with it a number of tasks that take up a lot of time and add a lot of stress to your plate. As a member of the educational community, I'd love to see you get some of your time back by making a few of those tasks a little bit easier. Check out Parsec's resource section on our website. It has multiple tools for helping you with your LCAP or strategic plan and your end of year climate and culture check-ins. Go to www.parseceducation.com slash resources.

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This transcript was created from the episode's captions and lightly edited for readability. It may contain small errors; please refer to the audio for exact wording.